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I would really appreciate hearing what you are using for 300 Blackout, why and your results.
Please include everything you think may be pertinent. Barrel length, gas system length, velocity, powder type, specific bullet and expansion of or lack of, etc.
My very first batch.
I was trying to use powder I had on hand.
2400 and 150gr Remington PSPCL retreived from a sand/clay media fired from about 40 feet.
Penetration was about 12".
16" barrel pistol length system.
Got one reading from the chronograph that session of 1551fps.
I have no idea why one is almost perfect.
Attachment 263
I use Lil Gun, H110, H108, 296 and 1680. 2400 should be good. What is the COL for your load?
2.220"
Attachment 264
I've tried several different powders and bullets, but the one I've tested the most is the cast lead and powder coated 133 grain lyman 311410 bullet using 17.2 grains of IMR 4227. From a 16 inch barrel I get 2000 fps and under 1 inch groups at 50 yds.
My rifle is a 10.5", pistol length gas system, standard buffer and extra power buffer spring. I can't speak of expansion because I'm not a hunter. My main powders are lil'gun and IMR4227, I'll try to run down some of the loads I use and have used in the past.
All loads use CCI small rifle primers
150gr hornady FMJBT or nosler ballistic silvertip
16.8gr lil'gun
Seated to cannelure on hornady, unsure of oal but roughly the same on the ballistic silvertip
Right around 1910fps on the silvertip, hornady should be close, haven't shot them over the chrono yet.
125gr Speer TNT
18.8gr lil'gun
2.070"
2150fps
240gr majestic cast/powder coated flat point
9.7gr IMR4227
2.230"
1020fps, cycled fine
155gr heavy plated spitzer-got em cheap, loaded me as cheap as possible
14.3gr lil'gun
Seated to what qualifies as a cannelure
1700fps, cycles fine on warm days, doesn't lock back on empty on cold days (under 30 degrees)
Great to blast through, not the most accurate though, but they were less than $23/100rounds loaded.
I posted this on the thread below, "How Many Grains of Trail Boss....". So I thought I would repost it here for you.
I've tried 5 different powders for subs. 220gr Nosler BTHPM and 10.9grs. of 1680 turned out to be the best load by far. Consistent SDs and primers, consistent velocity, and great accuracy.
The worst was Lil'gun. Big swings in SD, some primers looking like they were just inserted (except the firing pin divot) and some looking like an overcharge (flat. I mean really flat).
All loads were individually weighed using my Ohaus M5 beam scale and LC converted brass.
Trail boss will not cycle my carbine. TB has it's nitch but not in this application.
IMR4198 and H110 worked OK but 1680 was noticeably more accurate.
For plinking loads I tried several different powders and I settled on 150gr Sierra FMJBT Gamekings with 17 grs of H110. It's a very accurate load.
For Whitetail hunting I settled on Nosler 125 gr Ballistic tip Spitzers with 21.5grs of 1680.
Dave
I haven't loaded a lot for .300 Blackout and only shot a few of my reloads once, so my data is limited. I'm currently using Hodgdon Lil' Gun because that was all I could find at the time. I did come across some H110 at some point, but have yet to use it. Ideally, I would like to use Accurate 1680 because I hear good things about it in .300 BLK and I can use it in 7.62 X 39, too. However I haven't had any luck finding it in local stores and I hardly ever make it to gun shows to look for powder because they always seem to be on weekends that I have to work. That being said, here is the very limited data from one small batch of reloads.
Case = Hornady
Primer = TulAmmo KVB-223
Powder = Lil' Gun (14.7 grains, starting load for this powder per the Hornady manual, 9th edition)
Bullet = Hornady SST, 125 grain
COAL = 2.100"
Average velocity = 2050 fps (Hornady manual stated this powder charge would be good for about 1700 fps, but they used Winchester small rifle primers. Maybe this made a difference?)
Barrel length = 16"
Gas system = carbine length
I only chronographed 5 rounds. The first four rounds had an extreme spread (ES) of 32. The last round was only 1972 fps and pushed my ES to 117 and my standard deviation 45.
I have some more reloads waiting to be shot and chronographed, but I need to replace the front brakes on my truck before I can make it back to the range. I don't think my car can make it back there, not enough ground clearance.
Ed
I was using 110 grain bullets, and Win 296.
So far this is what I've tested for velocity and function.
Trail Boss with 150gr PSPCL averaged 850fps, as expected it did not cycle the action.
2400 with 150gr PSPCL averaged 1530fps.
2400 with 150gr PSPCL averaged 1650fps.
2400 with 135gr Sierra #2124 averaged 1870fps.
My thin g is I don't have a sound suppressor on my rifle, so I see no need to go big and subsonic. I have tried a few 150 grain bullets but they seem just a bit too long. I stuck to like 110 grain bullets. More velocity.
I like to load them cheap. Preferably under $25/100. That's usually 150gr fmj or 155gr plated.
A couple of more today.
AA1680 with 135gr Sierra #2124 averaged 1940fps and a little less than 1" groups at 50 yards.
AA1680 with 150gr Rem. PSPCL averaged 1870fps and a little less than 1" groups at 50 yards.
Started testing some loads with a 7 1/2" barrel.
AA1680 with 135gr Sierra #2124 averaged 1533fps.
AA1680 with 150gr Rem. PSPCL averaged 1438fps.
AA2230 with powder coated 166gr Lee c309-160-R averaged 1315fps.
AA1680 with 220gr Nosler RN #30181 averaged 1116fps.
Attachment 314
Did you notice any considerable drops in performance, Mbaker78?Quote:
Originally Posted by Mbaker78
I only hunt paper and steel, and the blackout rarely gets shot over 100 yards. So there’s not much concern over performance for me. As long as it cycles and it fairly accurate, I’m ok with it.
As a NRA Instructor for Metallic cartridge Reloading, I WINCE every time I see someone posting actual amount of powder used in a cartridge. It's just too easy to make an honest mistake. I urge everyone, including the original poster, to refrain from being that specific with powder loads. All it takes is that one well intentioned mistake to get someone's fingers (and gun) hurt.
Instead, you could suggest a powder, but leave the amount of that powder to the reloading data book. Alternatively, you can call the powder manufacturer, and get starting and max load data for any bullet and powder combination.
So, for example, for my 300 Blackout loads, I use a 150 grain home made (swaged) bullet, and Lil Gun powder. Lil Gun is made by Hodgdon. The amount of that powder is well documented in both the Tenth Edition of the Hornady Reloading data book, as well as the 14th Edition of the Speer reloading book. It's also well documented at Hodgdon's web based Load Data area: http://www.hodgdonreloading.com/
Additionally, Hodgdon's tech support guys are eager and happy to guide you with regard to starting loads and max loads for any bullet weight, either jacketed or cast.
The contact information is:
You can reach a Hodgdon representative Monday-Thursday, 7:00 AM-5:00 PM.
Address:
6430 Vista Drive
Shawnee, KS 66218
Phone:
(913) 362-9455
Fax:
(913) 362-1307
NOTE: All of the powder manufacturers have a deep vested interest in keeping you safe, and will reply to your inquiry very quickly.
Now, having said that, I know that some of you will take exception to my warnings. Especially those of you who are "very experienced reloaders". However, I have been doing this for more than 45 years, 20+ of that as a certified NRA instructor (and one of the very few, they tell me, that got 100% on the test for certification) for all these years, I have seen too many people get injured by using the kind of "heresay" load data that gets posted by well meaning friendly people. If you want to use what someone posts as a starting point for research, go ahead. But, please (I am begging you) research the information before using it. Confirm from a safe resource, that it's indeed safe to use. Let's NOT turn this thread into some sort of debate about what's safe and what's not. If it goes in that direction, I will lock the thread. Just suffice it to say that it behooves you to be safe in your reloading. The safe way isn't always the FAST way. Do your homework before reloading everything. Including 300 Blackout (where the case volume is sufficiently small enough to go quickly from safe to dangerous.)
Thanks Duke
16" pistol length gas system.
150gr Hornady SSTs with Lil Gun in true 300BLK brass. Getting about 2000ft/sec and use this load for putting down coyotes...and general plinking.
230gr lead boolits that are powder coated with Lil Gun in true 300BLK brass. Got them down to 1050ft/sec and shooting suppressed on hogs. Cycles great but had to switch to 300blk specific mags due to the thickness of the boolit and I couldn't load the last 3 in the magazine without fail to feeds. New mags solved that issue.
I got some 160gr plated flatbase coming in the mail and I will test them out both suppressed and non-suppressed. Not worried about this gun cycling them, more worried about working the necks by expanding them for the flatbase.
I don't really get caught up on the ft/sec except to keep my suppressed loads subsonic...I shoot at 100 and then 200 yards on paper and then walk down to see the hole shape. So far my loads are nice and round and no signs of key holing.....my first loads starting at minimum and working up saw a lot of early key holing at even 100 yards.
For the life of me I can’t work this out.
These are the 220gr #30181 Nosler bullets.
Every single load with 2400 or 1680 keyholes.
Velocity ranged from 1100fps to 1240fps.
Lee factory crimped, to no crimp at all.
COAL 2.0950”
Barrels used were a 7 1/2” 1:7” twist, 11 1/2” 1:8” twist and 16” 1:8” twist.
This one was at 100 yards with the 11 1/2” barrel.
Attachment 325
Not enough velocity to stabilize that heavy bullet. Combined with the short barrels = key holes
Is there a reason to use those heavy bullets?? I have wonderful performance with 150 grain bullets.
Most people loading the 220 bullets are striving for shooting them through a suppressor, and staying SUBsonic. You didn't mention that in the post.
So, unless that's your goal, go lighter on the bullets, and you'll have much better success.
BTW, I ONLY EVER use Lil Gun powder for my 300 Blackout loads. It's got a perfect burn rate for the chambering.
And, properly neck sized (Full length sizing only!), there will be enough friction between the necks and the bullets to hold onto the bullets while the powder all burns inside the case , before the bullet leaves the case mouth. So, no need to ever crimp (unless you are seating cast lead bullets, after "M Die/Lyman" expanding the necks.) Otherwise, no crimps, and you will get better consistancy of the velocities.
I bought or had a few differing weights and styles of bullets and felt the need to try them.
It got so bad I also started buying more firearms to experiment with too!
The 300aac has turned into a very interesting caliber for me! My only real interest is for hunting purposes. No real intent for the need of subsonic or suppressed.
In the 7 1/2” barrel the favorite has become the 150gr Hornady RN with 1680. With the 16” barrel the 135gr Sierra HP has become the favorite.
The cast powder coated Lee bullet loads was basically because I had all the components on hand. I will play with them a little closer in the 11 1/2” barrel.
My go to subsonic load was 9.X gr of IMR4227 under a 240gr cast coated bullet with the 10.5” 1:8” barrel, since switching to a 9.5” 1:7” barrel I’m getting keyholes (but it was about 40 degrees cooler than when I first worked up the load) and baffle strikes. Luckily there’s no damage to the can, but I was getting lead pieces clear back in the fire control group. So that load will be saved for warmer weather and retried (without the can first).
My next task is to get some of the lee 230gr cast to try them out, probably with 1680 as I have a pound of that on the shelf.
Tomorrow...unless I can't handle the cold...I'm going to shoot some 150gr plated flatbase flat nosed bullets I got from everglades ammo....I got loads from 8gr to 17gr loaded in .5gr steps...going to measure speed, deviation of 5 shot groups, accuracy...and keyholing....and at the top of the range at 2000+fps...how well they work since they are warned as low velocity bullets due to copper plate...we'll see.
Edit...this is with Lil'gun.
If it’s abnormally cold, your velocities could be lower than expected. And it seems like lilgun is somewhat temp sensitive.
It was 28F when I shot...data was a little off from what I expected...I think I'll go out and test 12gr-17gr once the temp rises above 60F...I think it was more of a: "me get out of the house and go shoot" thing...than it was an actual gathering of good data...was fun...but now time to warm up with some KY Bourbon and watch YouTube videos of 300PRC rifles...since that is my next project.
I think my next project will likely be a decent bolt action 22lr, it should be a decent challenge to shoot it out to 300 yards effectively, and a lot cheaper than my 308 ;)
After you fire the .22 LR bolt action rifle, save your brass to make these:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...tart-to-finish
Free bullets, which makes your AR15 reloading very cheap. I make those by the tens of thousands, and my only cost of reloading is the primer and powder.
And, I also make my 300 Blackout and 308 Win bullets from scrap 5.7X28 FN brass (as the donor jacket):
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/show...-x-28-FN-brass
I also make 380 auto (100 gr) and 9mm (125 gr, Both from 223 Rem Brass); and .40 (165 gr from 9mm brass); and 44 caliber (various weights from .40 S&W brass); and 45 ACP (230 gr from .40 S&W brass); and 500 S&W Magnum bullets (from 45 ACP small primer brass), all virtually for free. Check out the SWAGING area of the castboolits site for details on how to do this. The tools are expensive, but have paid for themselves many times over at this point. Some guys with machining skills even make their own tooling. The swaging is all done on a modified RCBS Rockchucker (the old model) press. Grade 8 pivot pin for the bottom of a custom ram (1/2-20 threads at the top instead of the normal T-Slot.
I do the .22lr to 5.56 using a set of corbin dies....I do the 9mm to 40S&W using some BTSniper dies. I've made enough 40 to last a lifetime.....and I'm only about 5k bullets into my 22lr to 5.56 journey...but a fun journey it is.
im still saving up to complete my 223 bullet making set, ive gotten them a piece at a time. i still need the point finisher die and a core mold
I’m nowhere near being able to afford the dies to make my own jacketed bullets yet... I still need to get set up to try casting for the pistols.